In April 2011, Insight Labs convened a session in partnership with Genesis at the Crossroads, a remarkable Chicago non-profit that seeks to promote world peace through music. Unlike many Lab participants, Genesis did not have a single obvious problem that needed to be solved, but founder Wendy Sternberg knew she was interested in figuring out how to better take advantage of the palpable enthusiasm that seems to come from everyone who experiences one of the group’s musical events. Labs Dean Jeff Leitner called it a problem of “converting fans into supporters.” But as usual, the conversation in the lab addressed ideas much more fundamental than a new marketing plan.

One participant in this Lab was Saya Hillman, founder of Mac ‘n Cheese Productions. In addition to her award-winning digital media work, Hillman has built a totally original business out of events that help people make new connections — connections that can lead to friendship, romance, and business opportunities, but don’t necessarily have to. Her events have included everything from the “Minglers” she organizes at her home to film screenings to the recent Fear Experiment. Shortly after the session with Genesis she spoke to Insight Labs Content Director Andrew Benedict-Nelson about her changed perspective on music and peace, how to get people to let down their guard and get creative, and why a Lab could be a great place to meet a potential mate, as long as we don’t tell anybody — oops.

Andrew Benedict-Nelson: How would you tell the story of your Insight Labs experience?

Saya Hillman: The beginning I would say was before the lab even started most of us did a little prep work on the organization so that we could jump in full steam ahead. … It seemed like a lot of us really took that seriously. People really came in with very good questions and ideas. … I was blown away by the wide range of experiences and skills. Before we even started I was kind of jumping out of my skin with excitement …

The middle part would be when we were kind of trying out ideas. Wendy [Sternberg] and her organization do lots of wonderful things but we were wondering what was the main thing we could focus on. After a time of bouncing back and forth I think we settled on a few things we could offer, some tangible solutions. …

I’m so attracted to situations where complete strangers are so giving of themselves, and giving to someone they don’t know at all. That was very evident at the lab.

ABN: Had you heard of Genesis at the Crossroads or the work they do before the Lab?

SH: No, I had not, I knew nothing, so I’m glad Jeff sent us all that stuff ahead of time. … It seemed like most of the people who came to the Lab had  the same notion that Genesis was doing a lot of good but they were kind of all over the place with a lot of different ideas and programs. Maybe one of the main conclusions we came to was that Wendy needed to focus on just a few of them, whether it’s just working with kids  or with people affected by conflict. …

One of the things that attracted me to Wendy and Genesis was the focus on the arts and music. That’s something I use a lot in my work — art is really a great way to bridge gaps and to bring people together who wouldn’t normally be in the same realm. So I was really excited about what she was doing. I was thinking that these days it’s really easy to become numb, and that’s what she’s trying to fix. … [A]nother thing I think a lot of us were thinking was, that’s great that you want to bring music to people who are affected by conflict, but is that really going to do anything substantial? So we started talking about how does Wendy measure what she’s doing? … Many people, in order to get on board, they need to feel a personal connection. A lot of us at first didn’t feel that and with the statistics and facts some of our eyes started to glaze over.

Then at one point she said the word “lullaby.” And then we all started thinking about our own lullabies — “My mom used to do this, my dad used to do that.” Every time she started to tell a personal story or how something had personally affected her … everybody said, “That’s how you need to make your cause appeal to the masses.”

ABN: You mentioned how impressed you were by the variety of the people in the room. Is there anyone whose contributions you would like to emphasize in particular?

SH: I would definitely say the other Wendy, [Wendy MacGregor] the vice president at AOL who used to work at Feeding America. She seemed like a real driving force and had really specific ideas for Wendy. The fact that she had been at another non-profit really seemed to help. She had a marketing background and I think she gave the other Wendy some good marketing ideas.

It was kind of funny — I think male and female stereotypes kind of played out a little in the Lab. It seemed like a lot of the males were talking more about the kind of hard-line, money side. … A lot of the females in the room seemed to be using a softer touch. … I think it was Dan [Fietsam of Energy BBDO] who who was asking over and over, “Who’s your target audience?” I think Wendy took a little while to answer that question and  it shouldn’t take you long to answer it. I think Dan did a good job of getting us back to those basic questions.

ABN: And do you feel some of those questions were answered by the end of the Lab?

SH: Yes I do. I think one example of that is that at the end of the lab we were all of the mindset that focusing on children in her programs is a really good idea. … Who doesn’t love kids? It can be a lot easier to open up your checkbook, since they’re the future. A lot of people get jaded, talking about how we’ve been in wars for so many years … but when you see an Israeli kid and a Palestinian kid in the same room playing music together, then you start to have hope. …

I also think that by the end we understood that instead of focusing on the negative stuff with potential donors she should talk about the positive aspects. I used to wake up to NPR all the time, but who wants to start their day hearing about suicide bombings and car accidents and kids being left behind in the Chicago Public Schools? I’m not saying you should ignore all that stuff, but it’s easier to pull on someone’s heartstrings when you focus on the motivational and on the positive. I think Wendy grabbed on to that thinking and it will change the way she markets herself. …

ABN: Don’t you think it’s interesting that these room of supposedly hard-headed marketing types came to the conclusion that Wendy actually needed to be more personal?

SH: Absolutely, and it didn’t start out that way at all … but they came to conclusion that it needed to be a more intimate story.

ABN: I’d like to play a word-association game. I’m going to throw out some words and I would like to know how you would say you felt about the word before the lab, and then how you felt after the lab. Ready? Music.

SH: I think that pre-Lab music to me usually meant a radio station like 93 KXRT or the Dave Matthews Band at a summer festival. Post-Lab I would say that music still means all of that, but it also means a solution, a way to bring people together around something together.

ABN: Violence.

SH: I think the main thing that struck me with “violence” was when Wendy talking about seeing kids with huge guns, with Uzis. I think we see those images all the time. She talked about what a beautiful thing it would be, instead of seeing a gun, to see a violin in that kid’s hand. I think violence is one of those terms that we have become numb to, and post-Lab she made us realize we could be less numb to the violence happening in our own backyard and all over the world.

ABN: Peace.

SH: I don’t know. Peace. I don’t know if anything has necessarily changed as far as peace goes. I felt before this Lab and still feel now that peace is a beautiful word, but also one of those big-picture words you need to break down. … Actually, I do think the Lab made peace more narrow, but in a good way, in that if we achieved peace, this is what it would look like in this specific part of the world or this group of people. … I guess that I would say it made it more relevant and attainable.

ABN: We tend to refer to the non-profit or governmental organizations that we work with as “partners” rather than “clients” or “beneficiaries” because our experience has been that the professionals and private sector people invited to labs can take as much away from them as the non-profits. Is there something you took away from this event that you think could help you in your particular line of work?

SH: Sure — it was inspirational. I majored in English and sociology and before I began my self-employment I was in the non-profit nine-to-five world. Being with these business types, when they stared to throw around a lot of terms, but hearing a lot of this stuff for the first time would motivate me to get an MBA or shadow more business type people who had taken the traditional route of going to the University of Chicago or Kellogg. …

It was funny. I had never been in that building [600 W. Chicago Ave.] before. I got there a little bit earlier and I was hanging out in the lobby. It seemed like that building really attracts creative, fun, less traditional types. In the waiting room they have fun games to play and nobody was wearing a suit — they’re wearing jeans and polo shirts. Then the vibe of the Manifest offices … it seemed like the energy and the creativity was palpable. I don’t want to work in an office ever again, but being in that environment and being in the conference room with all those creative types made me put on my to-do list, “More collaboration with creative people.”

ABN: That’s funny about the 600 W. Chicago building. I have had the same thought — I don’t want to be tied to an office, but if I had one, that would be a pretty good place.

SH: When we left it was lunchtime, and I was telling myself, when people want to go to a bar to meet people, they should just go to that building. Everyone there seemed so young and beautiful.

ABN: Let’s say that Jeff and Howell and the other people who run Insight Labs suddenly got a horrible case of amnesia, and we had to round up a group of former participants to reconstruct the Lab experience for the good of humanity. What would you say are the key elements? Is there anything you would change?

SH: I really enjoyed the wide range of backgrounds of the participants. I would continue to do that. … I really love the writing on the walls aspect of it.  I thought that was really cool to see the progression of the day, starting with blank walls and ending up with lots of great ideas. … Jeff and I talked a little bit at the end, and he said people often ask him ahead of time, “Could you tell me who the other participants are going to be?” He makes the conscious choice not to tell people because with the Internet and Google people might do prep work and research all the other people ahead of time, which wasn’t the point.

So many wonderful things have come out of these labs, not just for the non-profit partners, but for the participants. But that’s not an incentive to do it. If it does that’s like the cherry on top. I like that aspect of it. I try to do the same thing for my events… you don’t want to come with the specific expectation that you’re going to get a job out of it or you’re going to get a client out of it. … i think that’s a wise decision on the Labs’ part. You know people are coming because they have some kind of skill or resource that could benefit the partner, but a lot of times they will get something out of it themselves.

ABN: How would you compare the Insight Labs with the kinds of events you organize?

SH: One similarity I liked is the fact that most people don’t know each other when they come into the room. My philosophy is that when you are in a setting where you know people you usually end up standing in the corner talking to them all night. It can be a very freeing thing to go somewhere where no one has any pre-conceived notion of you. You’re not this person who your friends know or your co-workers know. … You don’t have to worry about being the new kid because everybody is the new kid.

Another similarity — I think the lab has this built into it — is that there is no time for small talk. I love to jump past small talk and just get into the meat of a conversation, and in my events I try to facilitate that. … A lot of times people can be nervous about stepping on someone’s toes or disagreeing with someone they have just met. The cool thing about the Lab is that you can’t worry about hurting someone’s feelings or holding back or thinking, “Next time I see them I’ll say this.” That’s similar to a lot of the events I do….

Another thing is that the setting is intimate. I think there were 14 people in our lab … that is a really good size. There’s enough people that there’s a high level of energy and a lot of different opinions, but not too many that you’re fighting to talk over each other or you can’t remember who said what. …

One more thing is the fostering of community … in an interesting, unusual, and fun way. One thing I’ve noticed over the past six years is that people are so hungry for community. Now that we are connected on Facebook and Twitter it can seem like we are more connected than ever before, but out of your 500 Facebook friends, how many are actually your friends? Even though we know tons of people it can be very isolating to be out there these days, especially in a social sense, in a romantic sense. I think one thing I am trying to do that the Lab is doing a good job of is helping people make real connections, people who are going to bring some kind of tangible benefit to your life, not just another follower on Twitter.

ABN: I think there’s a weird kind of synergy between charity and romantic life — charities galas are social events, people think of volunteer opportunities as ways of meeting people, etc. Do you think we could have a sort of hybrid event that is part Insight Lab, part singles mixer?

SH: Yeah, absolutely!  I did a documentary on dating where I interviewed twelve people for an average of five hours per person. I think dating is one of those topics that everybody has an opinion on, where everyone has stories. Dating and pet peeves are the two topics you can start talking about with anyone and you’ll get to know that person really fast. So as far as doing a hybrid of charity and love … I think that’s great. My best relationships, and most of my friends’ best relationships, come from when they do something they want to do and they’re not doing it to meet people or going with the hope of a romantic relationship. You come out to a guitar class because you want to improve your skills or you volunteer because you want to volunteer. I think when you do something with hopes of meeting a romantic partner the end result will be that you feel unsuccessful if you don’t have a date at the end. That’s not a good way to live your life. You’re just setting yourself up for failure.

I think that as far as the Labs go I would never market it as a way for you to meet a potential mate, but I think that those relationships could come out of it. Volunteering lends itself to quick bonding. … People let down their guard of “I have to impress people and I have to act like someone I’m not.” When you’re volunteering, whether it’s doing something physical like planting trees or doing something like the Labs where you’re giving your time, I think you tend to be more yourself, and those are the people I want to meet. I don’t want to meet this facade you’ve put up, your gold-chain John Barleycorn gyrating personality. I want to meet that person who is sharing their skills and knowledge and passion.

That was one of the things that was so cool about this Lab. You could just see people’s faces light up when they contributed to the discussion. I would so much rather be in that kind of setting and ambiance. I think that if you go to a speed dating event or a Match.com event you’re just so nervous and you act ridiculous and you wear stuffy clothes. The Labs and my events let people wear flip-flops and jeans and shorts and be themselves.

ABN: It’s interesting how the value for making authentic connections with  people plummets when you market an event that way.

SH: Yeah, you definitely don’t need to market it as a mixer. There’s so much stigma attached to all of those different terms. I think if you said “mixer” or “networking” or “schmooze fest” or even “happy hour” people go into it with a different type of attitude. I would be very careful and wouldn’t use any of those words even if you were hoping that romantic relationships come out of it.

ABN: Well, I don’t think  you won’t have to worry about us organizing an Insight Labs mixer any time soon.

SH: No, I think you should! Because I would love to see the people in my Lab again, even though it wasn’t the purpose for us to chat and to get to know each other. I would love to meet participants in the other Labs too. I think it would be great to have a reunion every six months. I would love to hear updates from Wendy and all the other partners. I’m sure we’ll all get e-mails, but it would be really cool to have everyone in the same room with some drinks and cocktails. It would be cool to meet people who have had the same experience but a different experience. I think that would be the ultimate in fun.

ABN: Like you, we here at Insight Labs get a great thrill out of connecting people. But I think it’s interesting how that changes one’s relationship with the people who have been connected. What have you observed about that change?

SH: One of the most fulfilling and rewarding parts of what I do is the feedback I get from people. A specific example that comes to mind is this woman who first came to one of my minglers. She was really nice and came to four or five. Then I had a screening of my dating film sometime in the past year and she came by herself. She knew that one of the reasons she knew she could come by herself was … that all my events are very comfortable and friendly and welcoming. She realized that going places by yourself really opens you to meeting more people than if you went with a group of people. … She was nervous walking in but by the end of the night she knew everybody in the room.

I would multiply that one little story by hundreds. I get these stories from people all the time. … It’s made me realize that things I take for granted, like walking into social situations without knowing anyone, for many people that’s the kiss of death. They say they’re never, ever doing that. … It’s made me really appreciate the skills that I do have. … I think I do a good job of fostering a comfortable situation without making you feel like I’m taking pity on you. … All of us have so many powerful gifts to offer. I may not have capital or funds but I can offer a lot of other things that people find helpful, and it’s the same thing for other people. That’s one of my favorite things, seeing what people can bring to the table and how we can make something amazing when we bring all our skills and passions and interests to the table.

The most recent example is a project called Fear Experiment.. … On my life to-do list was “do a hip-hop dance routine on stage.” No one would ever pay to see me dance on stage badly by myself, so I concocted a situation with 16 friends who didn’t know each other, and that has turned into a sold-out show at the Park West. People in the audience have said, “This is one of the most uplifting things I’ve ever seen,” and the Park West has requested future openings. … I had no idea all this goodness would come of it. … It’s nice to be in a situation where people are seeking you out.

That was a huge thing we talked about with Wendy. You should have a cause you don’t have to market at all, because people are so excited about it. That’s where I am now in my professional life. I do not market at all. Everything is word of mouth — everyone is doing all the hard work for me. That lets you or lets Wendy spend more time doing the important things, and you don’t have to go chasing after potential funders. The amount of sponsors and donors who have approached me as a result of this event goes on and on and on. When you get a good idea it just kind of blows up.